Holistic Healing and Transformation with Acupuncturist Emma McCune
Emma shares what it was like to be raised between two entrepreneurial, yet very different households - one more methodical and the other more passionate. We discuss how this has led to her riding the line between traditional and esoteric in different aspects of her life - what she studied in college, how she relates to religion, her early career and how she runs her business today. Emma shares how burnout and developing Hashimoto's during her time in software sales prompted a self-healing journey, leading her to remission and a new career path focused on acupuncture, Chinese herbalism, and functional medicine. We touch on the importance of prioritizing both money, boundaries, and self-care to enhance her capacity to help others. Emma is empowered by the results she's seen in her patients and uses that to strengthen her trust that she's on the right path. Listen in to witness the power that can come from listening to your body and powerful intuition.
My Current Obsession: Tongue Scraper, The Toast Podcast
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Transcript:
00;00;07;04 - 00;00;30;22
Stephanie
I'm Stephanie Hammond and this is the Fruition podcast. On this show, I sit down with passionate people who've brought their dreams to fruition. We'll explore different versions of success and fulfillment and dig in to what was on their mind along the way. With these conversations, I hope we can all expand our sense of possibility. And who knows? Maybe hearing their stories will inspire you to take action on yours.
00;00;30;29 - 00;00;58;18
Stephanie
Hey, everybody. Today we're back with Acupuncturist herbalist and functional medicine practitioner Emma McCune. Yes, This is the daughter of Joey from episode eight. And yes, I do ask her what it was like growing up in Joey's household, arguing with a rain stick and a gong. We also talk about the influence Emma received from her dad's more traditional approach to work in life and her experience moving between those two environments.
00;00;58;20 - 00;01;22;21
Stephanie
We talk about religion, and I'm actually curious, is anyone here interested in a chat about spirituality? I'm not an expert, but I know some and I have my own opinions, and I just think it's interesting to hear how people discover and ultimately choose their spirituality or their religion and the extent to which they identify with it and why.
00;01;22;25 - 00;01;44;21
Stephanie
So Emma goes into it a little bit in this conversation, but let me know if you want more. She talks us through her early career in IT recruiting and then software sales and how the stress of these jobs and the nature of her lifestyle led to the onset of an autoimmune disease herself. Healing process completely changed the trajectory of her career and her life.
00;01;44;24 - 00;01;50;28
Stephanie
So we get into her transition and how she's redefined success for herself, how she thinks about money as a healer and a
00;01;50;28 - 00;01;51;29
Emma
00;01;51;29 - 00;02;17;04
Stephanie
Business owner, and where she sees her career going on this new path. I'm giving you two obsessions this week. The first is on theme with the episode. It's tongue scraping. If you don't do it, you need to immediately start. I use a tongue scraper any time you brush my teeth. When you're sleeping, your body is cleaning up your insides and it's getting rid of toxins through your sweat, your waste, and also through your tongue.
00;02;17;06 - 00;02;38;15
Stephanie
So when you wake up, you want to remove that from your body, not swallow it back down, not brush it around. Do you want to get it out of your mouth? It also removes bacteria that can cause cavities, gum, inflammation and bad breath. So pretty useful, I'd say. And it takes 2 seconds. So I can't think of any reason why you wouldn't.
00;02;38;21 - 00;03;12;21
Stephanie
Bonus obsession is the toast. It's a silly daily podcast with two sisters breaking down celeb news and all my favorite mindless shows. It's so much fun. And if you see me laughing to myself in the wild, I'm probably listening to these too. It's always nice to have something lighthearted to listen to. Just a reminder also that this episode is on YouTube, and if you want to see how adorable Emma is and how atrocious my hair looks, feel free to go cyberbullying me for that, but only if you subscribe first.
00;03;12;22 - 00;03;30;27
Stephanie
That's my only request. So if you want to see us in action, head over to YouTube and type in the fruition podcast and you will see our faces. Okay. I hope you enjoy. Have a gorgeous day.
00;03;31;00 - 00;03;31;17
Stephanie
Okay.
00;03;31;18 - 00;03;32;20
Emma
Hello, Emma.
00;03;32;20 - 00;03;36;24
Stephanie
Welcome to the FRUITION podcast. Thank you for being here.
00;03;36;26 - 00;03;38;20
Emma
Thank you for having me. I'm excited.
00;03;38;25 - 00;03;49;10
Stephanie
Your office is so beautiful. I can't wait to post pictures of it for everybody to see because it's so ecstatic and zen and calming. You did an amazing job. It's so pretty.
00;03;49;13 - 00;03;49;23
Emma
Thank you.
00;03;49;24 - 00;03;54;07
Stephanie
And you grew up here? Another Seattle girl, which actually, by the way.
00;03;54;09 - 00;03;54;19
Emma
Yeah.
00;03;54;19 - 00;04;09;15
Stephanie
I caught myself saying early so many times lately because I've been listening to the toast every day. Oh, my God. Every morning when I listen to it, I think of you. So you grew up here in. In Seattle, where in Seattle did you grow up?
00;04;09;17 - 00;04;28;22
Emma
Yeah, I grew up in West Seattle for the most part of my early childhood, and then my parents got divorced. So my dad moved to East Lake, and I stayed in West Seattle with my mom. And then we switched days, like every week with my brother and I. And then I went to high school at Seattle Prep. And it's really weird to have a business in East Lake.
00;04;28;22 - 00;04;32;00
Emma
I never thought I'd move back to Seattle, and I never thought I would work.
00;04;32;01 - 00;04;37;13
Emma
Three blocks from the house I grew up in. But it's funny how things work out.
00;04;37;19 - 00;04;43;25
Stephanie
So funny. Yeah, Yeah. We can't really make the plans that we think we want to for ourselves, but it's all for the best.
00;04;43;28 - 00;04;45;09
Emma
Yeah.
00;04;45;12 - 00;04;57;02
Stephanie
And we know your mom because she was on an episode a few back and she has built this beautiful sound healing temple into bloom. Have you been to visit? I assume you.
00;04;57;02 - 00;04;57;23
Emma
Have.
00;04;57;26 - 00;05;15;04
Emma
Yeah. She is a force of nature. I feel like she's my mom in many ways, but yeah, that place is stunning. I try to go as much as possible. It was a lot easier when I was on the East Coast because, you know, it's a much shorter flight. But coming from the West Coast, it's a little bit longer.
00;05;15;04 - 00;05;19;27
Emma
And now having started this business, it's harder to take time off. But I'm hoping.
00;05;19;29 - 00;05;21;15
Emma
Soon.
00;05;21;17 - 00;05;25;01
Emma
Maybe I'm actually thinking maybe I'll lead a retreat down here. Oh, my.
00;05;25;01 - 00;05;30;01
Emma
Gosh. At some point such you're going to next genius.
00;05;30;01 - 00;05;56;05
Stephanie
That would be amazing. Yeah. It's a track from Seattle. I've never been there, but it seems gorgeous. Yeah, I'm dying to know what it was like growing up with your mom in her house. Of course, she. She gave us, like, a little flavor and said that you had to hold the talking stick if you were a fire. The rain stick, when you were arguing and there was a gong, you went back in your house like, was it did it feel like a spiritual household?
00;05;56;05 - 00;06;14;10
Stephanie
Like what was it like having Joey as a mother? And then she kind of explained that your dad is very different, maybe even like the polar opposite of her. So I'm curious what that dynamic was like growing up in her household and then switching between these two households. Like how.
00;06;14;10 - 00;06;15;16
Emma
Did you.
00;06;15;18 - 00;06;19;10
Stephanie
Develop your own sense of spiritual city from that?
00;06;19;12 - 00;06;37;14
Emma
Yeah, I think I'm very blessed to have two parents that have made me very well-rounded. They definitely are very different. But, you know, opposites attract, I think, when you're younger. So my mom is very free spirited.
00;06;37;16 - 00;06;40;27
Emma
I like my mom's free spirited.
00;06;40;27 - 00;07;10;17
Emma
She's very like a huge dreamer and she just gets things done. My dad absolutely does, too. But whereas my mom might be a little bit more impulsive, not impulsive in like the negative sense of the term, but inspired action, my dad is going to be more thoughtful and take his time really thinking through everything. And I'm lucky because both of my parents and my step parents, they're all entrepreneurs.
00;07;10;19 - 00;07;11;06
Emma
So to.
00;07;11;06 - 00;07;11;22
Emma
Me it.
00;07;11;22 - 00;07;40;08
Emma
Was a similarity of their wow and all different fields. So I guess in that sense, you know, everybody is not completely risk averse, but I would say my dad has definitely instilled in me more values of being thoughtful and maybe thinking before I act. And my mom has instilled in me just inspiration and going after your dreams and gosh.
00;07;40;10 - 00;07;41;26
Emma
Yeah. So balance.
00;07;41;28 - 00;07;58;11
Emma
Yeah, yeah. I would say growing up, though, to answer your question, it wasn't until I feel like high school that she started really getting into the more spiritual. I mean, growing up in Seattle, you're always kind of exposed to natural healing elements.
00;07;58;11 - 00;08;03;03
Emma
And hippies and, you know, from food and, you know, all that.
00;08;03;05 - 00;08;17;26
Emma
You people typically, you know, associate with more of a spiritual lifestyle. But yeah, there was a moment where she started bringing out the drum circle for the family with.
00;08;17;26 - 00;08;30;05
Emma
A talking stick. And I see I don't think my brother and I took it seriously. And then she would get upset with us because of like knocked on the head with the rain and.
00;08;30;08 - 00;08;34;24
Stephanie
This is when you were in high school, so you had like a fully formed opinion. Yeah. Oh, yeah.
00;08;34;24 - 00;08;37;07
Emma
And I think you got me. I'm I did not play.
00;08;37;09 - 00;09;05;06
Emma
A part too. I mean, I definitely think I've always been pretty open minded. Thankfully, both my parents are. I was raised in a religious household. My mom comes from an Italian Catholic family. My dad's family are all lost. So then and you know, I went to Seattle Prep Jesuit High School and went to church growing up. So there's always been that kind of spirituality within just.
00;09;05;09 - 00;09;06;10
Emma
The.
00;09;06;12 - 00;09;08;14
Emma
Array of like our childhood.
00;09;08;17 - 00;09;08;26
Stephanie
And.
00;09;09;00 - 00;09;34;28
Emma
Then I would say kind of branching out more into a less defined institutionalized definition of religion has been influenced by my mother quite a bit. And while it might have seemed out there for me at the time, I definitely think it's pushed me to explore other parts of myself. And I think she's amazing because she talks about things so openly.
00;09;35;04 - 00;09;52;06
Emma
I feel like spirituality for me is very personal. So I think in high school, when she wanted to do like the drum circles and everything, I resisted a little bit because I didn't. I was so concerned about what other people thought about it rather than what resonated in my own soul.
00;09;52;08 - 00;09;56;29
Stephanie
As a teenager. You're like, Can you please just not tell me what it was like?
00;09;57;01 - 00;10;01;09
Emma
I just want to blend in.
00;10;01;12 - 00;10;22;01
Stephanie
And are you adopting some of it now? Do you like it as an aspect of your life that you have that available to you? And she seems like such an amazing sounding board to have. First of all, she's probably teaching you about all these like new interesting approaches or like modalities that are out there that probably takes a little while to reach like.
00;10;22;03 - 00;10;23;02
Emma
Yeah.
00;10;23;05 - 00;10;24;22
Emma
It's scream. Yeah.
00;10;24;25 - 00;10;31;13
Stephanie
Yeah. So is that helpful to have around like someone to talk to and kind of like a lot of them that way.
00;10;31;13 - 00;10;52;13
Emma
I think she definitely pushes my boundaries, like my comfort boundaries in a positive way. Every time I go to visit, I had a girlfriend and I went down last July. I was going through kind of early stages of a breakup, so it was just a great girls trip. And my mom had set up. I mean, she's just an amazing entertainer in general.
00;10;52;13 - 00;11;12;02
Emma
She always has been spirituality. I mean, she's definitely like more is more a kind of person, which makes everything she does so amazing. So when we went down there, we did everything we did Soundscape Breathwork, we did all that love and I am not good. I've never.
00;11;12;02 - 00;11;13;11
Stephanie
Done that.
00;11;13;13 - 00;11;14;01
Emma
Okay.
00;11;14;03 - 00;11;19;09
Emma
He extremes cold extremes, whatever like very temperate weather girl.
00;11;19;14 - 00;11;25;22
Emma
And the sweat lodge really tested me like I had he got me after.
00;11;25;22 - 00;11;35;21
Stephanie
Actually. Really? Well, actually, can you just tell me what it is? Because I know a sauna. Like, I understand there's a sauna. There's a steam room. But like, what makes it a sweat lodge?
00;11;35;26 - 00;11;56;26
Emma
So it's called a tennis scout and it's hot. That's I think it's built out of play. Don't quote me on this, but it's built into on top of the ground. And there's a fire pit inside. And they have these, I think they're volcanic rocks and they they mean they contain a lot of heat. They're heated up outside of the lodge before you go in.
00;11;57;03 - 00;12;02;00
Emma
And then they add the rocks as you're sitting there into it and they shut the.
00;12;02;00 - 00;12;02;28
Stephanie
Door, adding heat.
00;12;02;28 - 00;12;06;17
Emma
And so, yeah. Oh, my God, Really? It's pitch black in there.
00;12;06;20 - 00;12;16;03
Emma
So I'm so claustrophobic, too. I felt like I was having a rebirth in there just dealing with all of my demons. Oh, my. And the woman that.
00;12;16;03 - 00;12;32;05
Emma
Led it is amazing. I mean, that's another great thing about my mom is she is so I'm going she's so connected to so many amazing healers. But you probably otherwise be connected to. So I feel really lucky that whenever I go, she always sets up.
00;12;32;07 - 00;12;34;02
Emma
You know, the best thing.
00;12;34;05 - 00;12;36;00
Emma
Yeah. So.
00;12;36;02 - 00;12;37;11
Stephanie
Damn.
00;12;37;14 - 00;12;38;12
Emma
I can't remember the exact.
00;12;38;13 - 00;12;40;10
Emma
Got to be exact.
00;12;40;12 - 00;12;55;06
Stephanie
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I definitely like to geek out on stuff like that, so I think it'd be really entertaining, but just imagining going through something in your life and then using those different modalities and using her as a sounding board, I think would be very beneficial.
00;12;55;06 - 00;12;56;26
Emma
That's been going on for years.
00;12;56;28 - 00;13;26;04
Stephanie
So going back to that, like those teenage years of kind of seeing your mom's awakening and then seeing how different that is from how your dad lives his lifestyle at A were you thinking at that point like, that's too much for me? I don't think I want to go in that direction. And I'm excited to have kind of like your typical college experience.
00;13;26;06 - 00;13;47;01
Emma
Yeah, that's a good question. I feel like because my parents are so different, I always have this internal conflict between who am I? Am I in this more extreme version of my mom? I am more this extreme version of my dad. How do I reconcile the two? And I think I'm still dealing with that at 29.
00;13;47;04 - 00;13;47;13
Emma
I don't know.
00;13;47;21 - 00;13;51;11
Emma
Yeah, that's the thing. And maybe that's just part of the complexity that makes sense.
00;13;51;11 - 00;13;52;26
Emma
When you're both.
00;13;52;28 - 00;13;54;16
Stephanie
You know, you don't have to be one or the other.
00;13;54;22 - 00;13;58;25
Emma
Yeah, I would say I've always been drawn.
00;13;58;25 - 00;14;00;03
Emma
To the.
00;14;00;06 - 00;14;25;03
Emma
More esoteric things like growing up. I loved astrology, which now is so popular and a lot of people think it's crazy, but it's been an amazing way for me to make sense of life events and my personality. And I think I've always been open to those things. But it's kind of like I like to dip my toe in the water and my mom, like.
00;14;25;04 - 00;14;32;13
Emma
Wants to jump in. She's like, Oh, cannonball, It's great, it's good and it's amazing.
00;14;32;15 - 00;15;09;00
Emma
But and to be fair, my dad's very open minded, too. He just has a traditional view. And every conversation I've had with him about spirituality, he's it's very easy to talk to him about. And you entertain other realities for other people. So I do feel grateful that both of them are open minded. But I did. I think my mom, my dad definitely instilled in us, you know, education, work hard, go to as good of schools as you can, so you can have a great network, great opportunities, and do what you want to do.
00;15;09;00 - 00;15;15;09
Emma
Just make sure that you're the best at doing it. So no pressure.
00;15;15;12 - 00;15;15;20
Emma
But.
00;15;15;20 - 00;15;44;19
Stephanie
Funny because you kind of showed that like you kind of lived out both sides of that in your studies in school because you went to Colgate, which is like this really traditional. You correct me if I'm wrong, you studied psychology and theology, right? So to me, from the outsider's perspective, which I know nothing about, psychology or epidemiology or Colgate really matter, it seems like kind of both sides of the coin, like you got a little bit of both worlds mixed into that college experience.
00;15;44;21 - 00;16;03;28
Emma
Yeah, I knew that I wanted a traditional college experience because my dad is so close with his college friends. They're basically all my uncles. Like I've grown up with his. He played rugby in college like all of his brother's. Like it's just been such a great community that I wanted to replicate that and I knew I wanted to go back East to do that.
00;16;03;28 - 00;16;27;25
Emma
As well then and my family on the East Coast, you know, a lot of family, a name that we see every year. And my mom was actually very encouraging of that as well. I don't think she looked at it as kind of an either or. I think she also just warms my brother knowing to have as many opportunities available so that played well into it.
00;16;27;25 - 00;16;28;06
Emma
Yeah.
00;16;28;11 - 00;16;32;00
Stephanie
Yeah. And how did you choose those two majors? Yeah.
00;16;32;00 - 00;16;55;28
Emma
Okay. So I guess in terms of always being drawn to maybe like more of the subconscious and I love people, I love connecting with people and it's very easy for me to do that, which I think, you know, later on brought me into more of a healing profession. And I just love learning about how people relate to each other and relate to the world.
00;16;55;28 - 00;17;19;11
Emma
And psychology and religion are two sides of the same coin to me. And going to a Catholic high school here, I was exposed to a lot of Christianity, which is beautiful, but I took a world religions class my senior year that I just loved. And maybe that's because learning about more of Eastern theology was just so different from what we're brought up with.
00;17;19;14 - 00;17;44;13
Emma
I felt like it was magical and I wanted to learn more. And also the more that I learned about all of these different religions, even when they seem so different on the surface, they really have so many similarities. And I thought that that was really beautiful to us. So I did a psychology major because I thought that that would be more lucrative, or I could use that in more ways.
00;17;44;16 - 00;17;49;02
Emma
I could take that pretty much anywhere post-grad. After like a liberal arts education, there's more of.
00;17;49;02 - 00;17;51;21
Stephanie
A path with it or I presumed.
00;17;51;21 - 00;17;52;16
Emma
Path.
00;17;52;19 - 00;17;58;04
Emma
Yes. And the religion Major, it was.
00;17;58;04 - 00;17;59;11
Emma
More.
00;17;59;13 - 00;18;09;04
Emma
Because I loved it, like I loved learning about it. I took I feel really lucky. One of my favorite classes in college was called End of the World, and it was.
00;18;09;06 - 00;18;09;22
Emma
Elliptic.
00;18;09;22 - 00;18;12;07
Emma
Literature.
00;18;12;10 - 00;18;14;24
Emma
So, so cool. I know. And it it.
00;18;14;24 - 00;18;20;22
Emma
Is really interesting. So we looked at the Qumran text. I don't know if you've heard of those, like the.
00;18;20;22 - 00;18;23;00
Emma
Book of the Watchers.
00;18;23;03 - 00;18;53;17
Emma
They were found at this archeological site and they're like lost canonical books, basically. And we looked at that and kind of like learning about these apocalyptic texts through the lens of the culture at the time and what kind of things we can draw from that. And maybe it being like a prophecy in like a literal sense, but it was for these communities and, you know, we looked at even like modern coal.
00;18;53;18 - 00;18;59;17
Emma
So I just find it so interesting. That is fascinating.
00;18;59;19 - 00;19;28;24
Emma
But I mean, even beyond like the more I don't I don't know what other term to use other than esoteric, but kind of the most awful side of religion that I feel very drawn to. I like my senior seminar was is called Sacred Texts. And we looked at the three major books in Judaism, Islam and Christianity and looked at like the same parables and kind of dissected them and looked at their similarities and the differences that came out of the different cultures.
00;19;28;24 - 00;19;43;03
Emma
And I again, it just really cemented in me that humans are complex, but we're also very simple and we all kind of just need the same values to live our lives by and connect to others with.
00;19;43;03 - 00;19;45;01
Emma
So yeah.
00;19;45;04 - 00;19;47;01
Emma
I hope that answers your.
00;19;47;03 - 00;20;02;15
Stephanie
Interest in having studied all those different religions and sacred books, do you feel like you identified more so with one than the others, or did you just come to that conclusion like it's all kind of the same? But yeah, different things.
00;20;02;18 - 00;20;27;15
Emma
My relationship with religion has changed, has gone through so many evolutions. I feel like growing up I'm very I'm not a person that breaks rules ever. Like when I would do something wrong as a kid, I would get caught immediately. I'm a liar. So growing up, like, I really took my religion seriously and then kind of had like.
00;20;27;18 - 00;20;31;05
Emma
Come to Jesus moment, it, you know, one intended.
00;20;31;05 - 00;20;55;08
Emma
But with news like world religion forces and like my my theology major in college with a focus on Eastern theology, I really started pushing back against the institutionalization of religion and just kind of seeing some of the things I didn't like that came out of that. And a very stringent view on what is good and what is bad.
00;20;55;10 - 00;21;19;10
Emma
That seemed very black and white and then actually like post grad. And the more I feel into my own spirituality, I do feel like I identify most with Christianity, but I love learning about all other religions. So I'm not I yeah, I don't think that I would pigeonhole myself into one particular thing. I mean, I'm not Jewish.
00;21;19;12 - 00;21;20;25
Emma
It was nine. You know.
00;21;20;27 - 00;21;26;08
Emma
None of my family members are Jewish. A bunch of my best friends are. They all went on birth, right? I wanted to go so badly.
00;21;26;12 - 00;21;30;02
Emma
I went on, I'm.
00;21;30;04 - 00;21;31;24
Stephanie
And when they have their partnerships, there's an environment.
00;21;31;25 - 00;21;35;16
Emma
That's I think we I know like I said.
00;21;35;16 - 00;21;40;10
Emma
But yeah so I would say probably mostly Christian but.
00;21;40;11 - 00;21;41;17
Stephanie
Just seeing a little.
00;21;41;17 - 00;21;42;09
Emma
Sparkle in.
00;21;42;09 - 00;21;42;18
Emma
There.
00;21;42;18 - 00;21;44;15
Stephanie
Yeah, that's so interesting. I mean.
00;21;44;15 - 00;21;45;09
Emma
I.
00;21;45;13 - 00;22;09;19
Stephanie
Have never liked the idea of having to choose one and I identify fully with one. I know that that's useful for many, many people and I think that's so great and important to them. You know, I think that you find what you need, but yeah, religion's always been such an interesting topic for me and I think it's interesting to talk about with different people because it can be so heated and so loaded.
00;22;09;19 - 00;22;27;12
Stephanie
But I want to at some point do a deep dive ish of the different religions because I just don't know enough about each of them. But I have always felt like identifying with one and only one isn't what's going to work for me like that.
00;22;27;14 - 00;22;29;04
Emma
It may be limiting, you know, and I feel is.
00;22;29;04 - 00;22;53;26
Stephanie
Really limiting. Yeah, yeah. And then the structure of it and like the institutionalized nature of religions has never quite felt right to me either. So yeah, I don't know. I definitely am a spiritual person, but that's been a new recognition of mine where I'm like, I can be spiritual, but I don't have to be religious and I can actually be the same thing in many conversations.
00;22;53;26 - 00;23;01;16
Stephanie
But it's it's just like how you identify yourself, I guess. I don't know. It's but it's been an interesting kind of like self study in that sense.
00;23;01;16 - 00;23;26;15
Emma
That, you know, I think we ebb and flow with our commitment to faith as well. Whatever that means to us. And I don't think it has to be a black and white thing. I mean, our culture is so individualized anyway, and that for better or for worse, but it does give us the flexibility to explore different things with respect and integrate the things that ring true to us and to our own lives.
00;23;26;15 - 00;23;27;29
Emma
And I think that's beautiful.
00;23;28;05 - 00;23;37;04
Stephanie
I totally agree. Yeah. So you studied psychology and Eastern theology and then you went into software sales in Boston, right? Okay.
00;23;37;11 - 00;23;43;05
Emma
So bridge that gap is like what are like your you were probably like.
00;23;43;05 - 00;23;52;29
Stephanie
Hey, I'm 22 and it's time to make money because I'm an independent now. So how how did you actually, like, sell software sales to yourself?
00;23;53;02 - 00;23;59;07
Emma
Yeah, actually, it wasn't so crazy. It was first it was recruiting OC OC.
00;23;59;09 - 00;24;03;09
Emma
Which is not for me, not for me at all. But it was a.
00;24;03;09 - 00;24;31;15
Emma
Type of sales and my staff actually has a I t recruiting company here. So and it was in Boston where I wanted to be for some silly reasons, but I, I would say it seemed like an easy next step. I wasn't thinking to long term about what are my career goals at 2122, I just was thinking, okay, like what do I do next?
00;24;31;15 - 00;24;55;00
Emma
I know I want to be I mean, my dad actually encouraged me to travel before I started working and really, I regret not following that advice. I will regret it forever, but I just thought it was what I needed to do and so I got a job and I accepted and I was there for seven months. It was a really toxic workplace for a number of different reasons.
00;24;55;02 - 00;25;18;06
Emma
And I got another job doing software sales for the startup, but it was for a recruiting software. So that was where I got into the tech sales world versus recruiting, and that was great. I feel like I learned so much. It was an early stage startup. I love the people that I worked with. It was a really tight community.
00;25;18;06 - 00;25;38;19
Emma
I was, I think the six sales person that they hired and learned a lot about myself. I really like sales. I was pretty good at it. And you know, it's great to get a commission. Nothing feels better than closing a deal, especially like when they have you ringing the gong. It just feels so good to bring it in.
00;25;38;23 - 00;26;04;28
Emma
But I would say that position got me into a good resumé builder for me to go to the next company, which is this company called HubSpot, and it's a sales and marketing software. Now I think it's more CRM since I left and it's growing. It's a great company to work for and that was my last software sales job, which I was at for about a year and a half.
00;26;05;01 - 00;26;05;17
Emma
Okay.
00;26;05;20 - 00;26;12;03
Stephanie
And were these other environments after that first job pretty healthy environments? Did you have good community there?
00;26;12;08 - 00;26;27;27
Emma
Yeah, I mean, sales is so interesting, especially Texas pre pre-COVID. I don't know what it's like now, but it's such a social environment. It kind of feels like an extension of college and whatever. And I think there is a lot of dysfunction in that.
00;26;28;00 - 00;26;28;23
Emma
At one point I was.
00;26;28;23 - 00;26;55;03
Emma
Looking around, I think I was 23 at that point and I thought, wow, like, I don't really want to be doing this stuff at these company parties at 30 or 40 whatever. When I'm married, you know, part of company culture, I guess. But and just the nature of sales, you have a lot of really outgoing people who like to be around other people and probably have pretty extreme personalities which make them really fun to hang out with.
00;26;55;05 - 00;27;22;21
Emma
So I wouldn't say I think there was it was much healthier than my first job for sure. But just being a person, I myself identify as somewhat like extreme natures. I kind of vacillate between 0% and 100% with most things. I think it wasn't the healthiest for me, and that's kind of how I made the decision to go back to school once I realized that it was impacting my physical health.
00;27;22;28 - 00;27;41;19
Stephanie
Yeah. Yeah. And how did that show up for you? I worked in consulting for a little while and it was similar. We all lived with each other and my God, it was a lot of partying and a lot of fun. But yeah, I it was not healthy at all. But mine manifested mostly as just like exhaustion, anxiety, weight gain.
00;27;41;19 - 00;27;42;25
Emma
But like always.
00;27;42;29 - 00;27;44;00
Stephanie
I know it can be so much.
00;27;44;00 - 00;28;13;08
Emma
Worse. Yeah, it's funny because I when I actually got diagnosed with Hashimoto's, which is a thyroid autoimmune, it's pretty common, but it doesn't that doesn't mean that it's not horrible to serious. Yeah, it's an autoimmune hypothyroid disease. So your thyroid is under functioning which controls your metabolism and of course all your other ones are related. So it kind of has a trickle down effect on your women's health, on stress, on everything.
00;28;13;08 - 00;28;23;07
Emma
Yeah, but you know, the root cause can be different for different people. But yeah, so thyroid dysfunction neatly.
00;28;23;10 - 00;28;30;29
Stephanie
And any sort of anything that impacts your hormones really has a ripple effect in every aspect of your life. That's a big deal.
00;28;31;02 - 00;28;56;15
Emma
So I was feeling so and autoimmune just means your body doesn't recognize it. Things that your own system is an intruder. So. So thyroid means that your body's attacking your thyroid, which is where the antibodies show up on blood test. And for me, like, I just felt really tired. I was gaining weight, like very swollen. But the fatigue and the brain fog were really, really bad.
00;28;56;20 - 00;29;06;01
Emma
But I didn't even realize that it was a problem at that point. I just thought that everybody felt like that in their mid-twenties, like early. I'm like, Oh, this is just like having a job, you know? I just.
00;29;06;01 - 00;29;06;14
Stephanie
Feel like.
00;29;06;14 - 00;29;10;15
Emma
Shit. I really did. And at the time.
00;29;10;18 - 00;29;16;07
Emma
My boyfriend at the time I had lived in Boston for I think three years at that point I didn't have a primary care.
00;29;16;07 - 00;29;19;18
Emma
Doctor, so now I have to go get a primary care doctor.
00;29;19;18 - 00;29;40;24
Emma
So I did. And part of the check checkup, my mom is Hashimoto's, my grandma has it. Really It is. It can be hereditary. Autoimmune is more common in women than in men in general. But there's didn't happen until they had kids. That hormonal change triggered it for them. So I always thought it would be when I had kids.
00;29;40;27 - 00;30;02;25
Emma
And I think the stress from my job coupled with some other things I have, it feels weird to talk about now, but because I feel like such a different person. But I had breast implants and I think that that was a really big trigger for my shoulders as well. My body did not like it and I had a lot of physical symptoms that were coming after that.
00;30;02;25 - 00;30;06;00
Emma
So the stress from the job and.
00;30;06;02 - 00;30;06;12
Emma
Not.
00;30;06;12 - 00;30;16;26
Emma
Living a really balanced lifestyle in terms of taking care of myself and I think also the breast implants at all was a perfect storm.
00;30;16;28 - 00;30;20;15
Stephanie
Yeah, So many people are talking about getting their implants removed.
00;30;20;17 - 00;30;25;21
Emma
Yeah, I had my neck planted two years ago and I feel like a slightly different person.
00;30;25;24 - 00;30;31;14
Stephanie
Yes. Insane. Yeah. Do you think just because it's a foreign object in your body and.
00;30;31;16 - 00;30;54;14
Emma
Yeah, you know, I think some people are more sensitive than others. I have a history of autoimmune in my family and it had, but it was mentioned at that point that it could be an issue, but not to the extent that I think it is now with so much more news coverage about it and more Doctor Who is actually recognizing that breast implant illness is a legitimate thing.
00;30;54;16 - 00;30;58;28
Emma
So, yeah, I mean, it's it's interesting for sure.
00;30;59;01 - 00;31;11;05
Stephanie
So how did you go about starting to heal yourself? You didn't even have a primary care doctor like, did this Is this what started your whole journey of learning about acupuncture and these different modalities that have helped you so much?
00;31;11;07 - 00;31;36;17
Emma
Yeah. So I went to this primary care doctor that I did sign up for, and she found out that I had this family history of Hashimoto's. So she tested me, came back hypothyroid, so she test me for antibodies and I had a lot of antibodies. And you have Hashimoto's, which is this autoimmune. And my mom has had it and she said, You know, I've been on this medication my whole life and they keep having up the dose.
00;31;36;17 - 00;31;45;15
Emma
I really recommend looking at seeing if you can do this holistically. I have some friends that did it. It's too late for me, but I wish that I could. I don't think it's too late for her. But now.
00;31;45;15 - 00;31;46;15
Stephanie
But your mission?
00;31;46;22 - 00;32;10;25
Emma
Yeah, I. I am very grateful that she suggested that I look at other options for treatment. That's what brought me to acupuncture and functional medicine. So I went to a functional medicine provider in Boston. She is an internist, M.D. So a functional medicine. It's, I would say, the biomedical approach to holistic health in the treatment of chronic illness.
00;32;10;25 - 00;32;50;02
Emma
So instead of the typical approach that we have within the Western world, which is treating the symptoms often with medication, not good or bad, just like the way that it is function medicine takes more of a diet and lifestyle. First approach very in-depth lab testing that isn't typically covered by insurance. And unfortunately, even though I really think that it should and that targeted supplementation and also within the lab tests as well, functional medicine has narrower and more narrow definition of optimal versus like what's normal.
00;32;50;02 - 00;32;53;17
Emma
So what is another kind of difference?
00;32;53;18 - 00;33;08;29
Stephanie
So like if you're getting a blood test, let's just use a really simple example. If you're getting a blood test, there could be a range of what's considered normal, but that doesn't mean that that's a healthy enough range. Like really, we can do better. And if we want to thrive or live well, then that's a narrower range. Okay.
00;33;09;04 - 00;33;22;09
Emma
Okay, Exactly. And so you see that especially in Hashimoto's, you see that a lot like your test levels can be it's more optimal to have it lower within the functional medicine sphere function because.
00;33;22;12 - 00;33;23;02
Emma
Normal.
00;33;23;02 - 00;33;25;16
Emma
Is just what most people have, but that doesn't mean.
00;33;25;18 - 00;33;27;25
Emma
It's healthy. Yeah, yeah.
00;33;27;25 - 00;33;42;23
Emma
That really was a game changer for me. I put myself on an autoimmune protocol, which is an elimination diet that is pretty hardcore. You cut out all inflammatory foods and then slowly reintroduce them. After about a month.
00;33;42;23 - 00;33;44;02
Emma
Or however.
00;33;44;05 - 00;33;44;23
Emma
If symptoms.
00;33;44;23 - 00;33;47;18
Stephanie
Go away that look like what was, you know.
00;33;47;19 - 00;33;55;17
Emma
It was grass fed me free range chicken, fresh wild fish, vegetable oils, and.
00;33;55;20 - 00;33;56;08
Emma
That's.
00;33;56;10 - 00;34;20;03
Emma
It. And then you slowly reintroduce each food group to see what triggers symptoms and that was really eye opening to me. Gluten. I'm not celiac, which is autoimmune, but I definitely am intolerant. And when I have gluten, my antibodies go up. I mean, you can have a lot of fear there. But like I said, I'm a person of extreme this.
00;34;20;05 - 00;34;24;13
Emma
It's hard for me to cut back if I have, I'm with you.
00;34;24;16 - 00;34;42;24
Emma
And so that was that was, like I said, a game changer. And then acupuncture was amazing as well, because I feel like the act of going to acupuncture really got me more in touch with my own body and feeling things inside my body. I think so many of us live in constant chronic stress or in fight or flight.
00;34;42;24 - 00;34;58;18
Emma
We live outside of our bodies. I can't tell you how many patients I have that come in and I ask them, How's your digestion? Or do you run hot or cold? And people can't, Oh, I run normal and then they're sweating on the table and you actually remember.
00;34;58;20 - 00;35;02;17
Emma
You're not normal. Let's talk about this and then the.
00;35;02;17 - 00;35;05;11
Emma
More they come, the more in touch they get with their bodies as well.
00;35;05;13 - 00;35;06;29
Stephanie
So interesting.
00;35;07;01 - 00;35;35;20
Emma
And then I think the acupuncture really helped my nervous system, which I think is should be the first step in healing all chronic diseases, nervous system regulation, because there's a lot of studies now that we've kind of started to figure out in the last five or ten years how to study acupuncture to prove its efficacy, which is pretty difficult because we don't have standardized protocols for specific diseases as we look at each patient as an individual.
00;35;35;22 - 00;36;01;23
Emma
So that means that if I'm getting treated for stress or if you're getting treated for stress, we might have two different constitutional patterns that lead to us experiencing stress and experiencing stress in a different way, which would change the treatment protocol and then change the prescription that we would use for that treatment. Wow. It's hard to do studies for that when you're trying to look at how does this one group of points affect so many people.
00;36;01;26 - 00;36;02;14
Emma
Because.
00;36;02;16 - 00;36;24;29
Emma
It really works that way. But I will say that there is a lot of literature now that shows how effective acupuncture is at putting you into that. Here's a pathetic nervous system state, which is that rest and digest, and it's just an amazing physical tool to switch that on because you can do that through meditation and you can do that through, you know, a lot of different tools.
00;36;24;29 - 00;36;34;20
Emma
But it can be hard when you're starting out and people get stressed out about doing things right too, is also just have another person to facilitate that for you.
00;36;34;20 - 00;37;02;18
Stephanie
Yeah, totally. It has immediate impacts. I think I told you that every time it would a needle would go here in between my pointer finger and my thumb. It was like, that's like, I feel like a nerve shock or something. I don't know what that feeling is, but it kind of like freaked me out a little bit. But then it's like my entire body could relax after that and it like totally removed the aching in my knees and a separately, Reiki really helped with that too.
00;37;02;18 - 00;37;28;09
Stephanie
Yeah. So for me and it's it helped my digestion. I was having just so many issues that I just really feel like when I went to acupuncture regularly, I think I went weekly for and like you said, it felt like it come to my whole body down and just like reset it, almost like it. It just got things like unstuck is when I felt like that's it.
00;37;28;09 - 00;37;53;19
Emma
I love hearing that you had such a positive impact, and I feel like most people do. I haven't had a patient yet, knock on wood that has said this hasn't worked for me in some way, shape or form. And yeah, I mean, it's just a really beautiful medicine and also like way to look at the world. It's based on QI and a balance between yin and yang, and it's.
00;37;53;21 - 00;37;54;17
Emma
A whole.
00;37;54;21 - 00;38;12;05
Emma
Paradigm that we're just so unfamiliar with in the Western world. So it makes it hard to study or understand because it's it's so different from what we're raised in. And I will be a student my whole life, even though I'm a practitioner now there's this there's thousands of years to learn from.
00;38;12;05 - 00;38;35;16
Stephanie
So yeah, we in Western culture are so specific about needing an answer to things and that is less of an emphasis or less of a priority in Eastern culture. But it just seems like when something's been working for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of years and there's so much proven evidence, like there doesn't have to be a reason why.
00;38;35;18 - 00;39;06;24
Emma
Yeah, yeah, I think there is probably a good balance that we can find. I think it's just learning. It's changing our approach to studying Chinese medicine in that work because you can see if I can put this the right way, you can't study a completely different, a completely different medical paradigm using your medical tools because the tools that we use and standardized protocols and randomized controlled trials, which are amazing and great ways of seeing how things work and if things are effective.
00;39;06;24 - 00;39;30;15
Emma
But in the Western world, like I mentioned, it doesn't really translate that well to studying Chinese medicine because we don't standardize protocols for the most part, like it sounds like we have a not a protocol, which is for regular acupuncture, great for helping people with addiction. We have a PTSD, a regular acupuncture protocol, but that's used in tandem with institutional treatments for the body that are individualized.
00;39;30;18 - 00;39;33;21
Emma
So, yeah, it's complicated. I'm not a researcher.
00;39;33;21 - 00;39;35;01
Emma
I never will. Yeah.
00;39;35;03 - 00;39;39;06
Emma
I'm happy that we have people that understand that because it is.
00;39;39;06 - 00;39;41;22
Emma
Complex doing it.
00;39;41;25 - 00;40;00;21
Stephanie
So you started learning it Well, first of all, you started using these different modalities to heal yourself and Hashimoto's. But then at what point did you start really educating yourself and decide, okay, I want to be a practitioner myself. When I was still in software sales at that point, or had you quit to focus on your healing.
00;40;00;24 - 00;40;13;19
Emma
Maybe this is where a little bit of I'm very similar to my mother comes in. I just had a pretty quickly that I was going to leave my software sales job behind and go back to school like it was after one one acupuncture treatment.
00;40;13;22 - 00;40;23;05
Emma
Wow. If you guys it's you know, I know it's it's getting longer. I am glad that it was that we're doing it.
00;40;23;07 - 00;40;47;03
Emma
Yeah maybe I don't know maybe it's being impulsive. Maybe it's listening to your intuition. When you feel drawn to something. There's a reason for that. And I actually up. I always wanted to be some kind of doctor or healer, so. And I have always been interested in health and wellness. So it didn't seem like that big of a leap.
00;40;47;03 - 00;41;04;12
Emma
And the benefit is I was coming from a job where I, in my sales role was consulting small businesses on how to grow and market their companies. So I felt like I had a good background for the business, but I knew that I wanted to open after I graduated. I always knew that I was going to open my own clinic.
00;41;04;14 - 00;41;14;02
Stephanie
Oh, okay, okay. Wow. So you went into school knowing once I graduated and I have whatever credentials I need, I'm going to be opening my own clinic and I'm going to do this solo.
00;41;14;04 - 00;41;15;04
Emma
Yeah. I mean.
00;41;15;04 - 00;41;16;06
Emma
The goal is.
00;41;16;09 - 00;41;30;15
Emma
Solo for sure. I don't. I am a people person. I love working with patients every day. But my maybe we can cover this later. My ultimate dream would be to fill this out and have other practitioners working with me, not even just in acupuncture, but like a whole integrative.
00;41;30;15 - 00;41;31;16
Emma
Wellness.
00;41;31;18 - 00;41;34;28
Emma
Clinic. I think that is beautiful. Yeah.
00;41;35;00 - 00;41;37;05
Stephanie
Why did you want to open your own clinic initially?
00;41;37;07 - 00;41;57;19
Emma
Yeah. I think there's a lot to be said about working for other providers, learning from them for sure. I am trying. That's on my to do list is to find a mentor here in Seattle that I can run case studies by. I have stayed close with a number of friends from my program. We continue to do that with each other.
00;41;57;24 - 00;42;17;04
Emma
I think that's really important because with a medicine like this, you don't know everything and you will never know everything, right? And I think humility is very important in any kind of career. So that part was a little intimidating about opening my own space. But yeah, it was just knowing that I knew that I wanted to do.
00;42;17;04 - 00;42;18;27
Emma
And yeah, yeah, there wasn't.
00;42;18;27 - 00;42;23;02
Emma
Another there was another option for me. I wanted to create something. I think that.
00;42;23;04 - 00;42;31;23
Stephanie
So you quit that job and then you went to school to study acupuncture and functional medicine. Was it both at the same time or were they two separate programs?
00;42;31;28 - 00;42;54;27
Emma
In separate programs? It was a little crazy. So I can tell you a little bit about acupuncture education as well, because a lot of people don't know how much goes into that. And obviously I'm biased because through it. But I did an accelerated three year program, which was year round. Often it takes people 4 to 5 years to go get their masters acupuncture.
00;42;55;00 - 00;43;13;22
Emma
There are a lot of Western science classes and medical classes that you have to take in order to get your masters. I had to take a bio medicine board exam, so it's not like what people think is kind of woo woo or pseudoscience acupuncture. There's a lot that goes into it.
00;43;13;25 - 00;43;14;09
Emma
And.
00;43;14;12 - 00;43;43;09
Emma
That's required and I guess makes it more legitimate in terms of our Western culture. And I did my master's in acupuncture and Chinese herbal medicine. So that's kind of a dual program. Herbs. Not all states require herbs to have an acupuncture license, but it was something that I knew I wanted to have to keep my options open. And I also did a Japanese acupuncture track as well through the school, which is pretty unique.
00;43;43;09 - 00;44;02;06
Stephanie
I've never even heard of that. Okay, So do you use obviously you use that in your practice, but do you also use your knowledge in Chinese herbs? I would love to have some base knowledge of how Chinese are work so that it's like satisfying my inner ten year old like yourself who want to take action and.
00;44;02;08 - 00;44;03;29
Emma
Might feel something.
00;44;04;02 - 00;44;25;09
Emma
If they feel like that for sure. Like in school here, I don't have my own pharmacy in my office. I outsource because I want to know that my patients are getting the best quality herbs and that way I don't have to worry about it here going bad or whatever, so I don't mix the formulas here myself anymore. But at school we did and it was definitely fun.
00;44;25;09 - 00;44;25;24
Emma
It did feel.
00;44;25;25 - 00;44;30;00
Emma
Like a little bit of a budget not to take away from the legitimacy of that.
00;44;30;00 - 00;44;35;26
Stephanie
Not totally, of course, because it is very legitimate, very effective, but also seems fun.
00;44;35;28 - 00;44;36;22
Emma
Yeah.
00;44;36;24 - 00;44;52;03
Stephanie
So did you heal yourself of Hashimoto's or is that something that you always live with for the rest of your life and it's just like dormant inside of you in some way and then if you eat too much gluten or if you aren't taking proper care of yourself in here too stressed out, then it can you have a flare up.
00;44;52;06 - 00;45;16;20
Emma
Yeah. So I did put it in remission. My body works in the range of normal. After doing the elimination diet and I wasn't on any medication, which I felt pretty good about. And then I went back to school. And, you know, stress is a major dietary trigger, and then COVID happened. So there is just a lot of high stress things going on.
00;45;16;25 - 00;45;47;24
Emma
I will say that it has never been as bad as when I got diagnosed, and I think that's because of the tools I now have available to me, whether that's acupuncture or a functional medicine and just having a more educated approach to living a healthy and more balanced lifestyle. So I would say it's managed really well. Now I am on thyroid hormone, it's not levothyroxine, which is the generic medication I'm on.
00;45;47;24 - 00;46;04;15
Emma
It's actually a supplement, but it's made from bovine glands, so like thyroid gland and adrenal glands. And it's mixed in with selenium and iodine and all the things that are good for your thyroid. So I take like one supplement a day and I like that.
00;46;04;17 - 00;46;38;10
Stephanie
Yeah. So it's very well-managed. Yeah. That's so incredible. Wow. So when you were going through school, it's you. You had a gut feeling you must have when you went and had that one acupuncture session and you decided that you were going to commit to this and leave software sales, what were you thinking to yourself in terms of like supporting yourself and your previous concept of what success meant to you, and how were you kind of changing that definition for what you wanted out of your life and how you were going to grapple with a completely different.
00;46;38;10 - 00;46;54;03
Emma
Lifestyle in terms of what success like? To me, I think success, my definition of success has definitely changed since I was 21, just entering the workforce and previously know in your early twenties. I wasn't thinking too much long term.
00;46;54;03 - 00;46;55;06
Emma
About what.
00;46;55;06 - 00;47;24;03
Emma
Kind of balls do I have, what kind of savings do I want, what kind of resources do I want to have under my name? It was more, how can I live the lifestyle that I want and buy the clothes that I want, which sounds so clean? And no, I think success is giving me freedom of choices and flexibility and the time to do the things that I want to do and also the money to do the things I want to do.
00;47;24;07 - 00;47;53;24
Emma
I feel like women are looked down on when they talk about wanting to make money and having that be a value. But I think that that's very important in knowing how to handle money, which has been something that I've been learning much more since going back to school and starting my own business. A lot of people think that they need to martyr themselves if they're in a healing profession and give all of themselves and not charge any money for their services just so they can give people the opportunity to heal.
00;47;53;27 - 00;48;16;10
Emma
I think that that's very noble. I absolutely want to make healing accessible to people 100%. That's very important. But you can't sell like you can't pour from an empty cup. So I think part of what I've learned in my healing journey is it's okay to put yourself first and take care of yourself. And that might look different to different people.
00;48;16;12 - 00;48;25;28
Emma
But yeah, as long as you're meeting your own basic needs, then you'll be in a place where you can give more fully to other people.
00;48;26;01 - 00;48;42;10
Stephanie
And it doesn't even have to be your basic needs. It can just your needs knowing what you want to do, how you want to spend your money and your time, and what you want your lifestyle to look like. Like you can have an extravagant lifestyle if you want to and still help people and serve to your highest capacity.
00;48;42;16 - 00;49;06;19
Stephanie
Probably more so just if you are absolutely met. I think it's so important and I love how many conversations are being had out there about not feeling ashamed about wanting to make money, like you said, and talking about money and having boundaries and the self-respect to command the earnings that you deserve based on the value that you're bringing to the table, which is a lot.
00;49;06;19 - 00;49;16;24
Stephanie
It's a high value service and just bringing yourself you have a lot of value. So you should be compensated for that. And not just fairly, but well.
00;49;16;27 - 00;49;29;13
Emma
Yeah, I agree with that as well. So I guess to your question about did I think about the change in lifestyle or I didn't at all, I think there is some delusion that is there.
00;49;29;15 - 00;49;34;07
Emma
I mean, some of this I don't know, I just kind of I guess I kind of.
00;49;34;07 - 00;49;57;07
Emma
And still in the process of just trusting that it's going to work out because I do feel that what I'm doing is something that I'm meant to be doing, at least at this stage of my life. And I feel fulfilled in the healing that I can facilitate for other people and in the empowerment that I can bring to people to learn about their own health.
00;49;57;07 - 00;50;18;16
Emma
Because I'm not like the person that's healing you. It's really you to continue to show up. You learning about your body, you learning to see like when there is warning signs going on in your body or not, and also learning how to nourish yourself in a way and create balance in your life. That's the basis of Chinese medicine, is how do we create balance and like free flow of energy.
00;50;18;19 - 00;50;37;17
Stephanie
By the way, though, for anybody listening, people who tell you that they are the ones healing you, listening to what they're doing and saying and their philosophy, because I feel like any legitimate anyone who has made a difference in my life. I'll say this what you just said, it's not me they're telling you. It's you getting to know your body.
00;50;37;20 - 00;50;59;15
Stephanie
So in terms of the logistics of starting and owning and running a business, how do you do that? Like, especially in this space where you need many license and credentials and it's it is regulated. I mean, you have to check a lot of boxes to get this done and to practice and and heal patients and bring in clients.
00;50;59;15 - 00;51;02;23
Stephanie
So how did you take that first step after you graduated from school?
00;51;02;23 - 00;51;10;00
Emma
Yeah, I will say I'm definitely not an expert. It's only been seven months of my business, so it's taken. I'm still learning and seven.
00;51;10;00 - 00;51;12;06
Stephanie
Months ahead of many other people.
00;51;12;08 - 00;51;14;06
Emma
That's truth.
00;51;14;09 - 00;51;34;23
Emma
I think it's good to just have to break the big picture goal of starting your own business down into multiple stacks. And that's what has made it seem very approachable for me. For me, the first thing I wanted to do was have a really strong brand. So I spent a year or two of my program outside of school and again, like I was really lit up by this.
00;51;34;23 - 00;51;58;22
Emma
This is so inspired by and I had a vision that I wanted to create into a tangible reality. So I spent the second year of my schooling researching great graphic designers or website builders that I thought would represent my brand well. Outsourcing is important, like knowing where your strengths are and where they are and finding the right partner to partner with is such an important part of business.
00;51;58;29 - 00;52;22;09
Emma
I feel lucky because I had money that I had. I chose to took out, take out some student loans for my grad school program to protect this money because I knew I wanted to open a clinic. So I budgeted. On our third year of school. I started to on that vision. So I do think that when things are meant to be, they happened really easily.
00;52;22;12 - 00;52;39;18
Emma
So I think we had talked previously, we met for coffee, but I did not expect to move back to Seattle. I was in a long term relationship. We were going to move to Austin, I was going to help my clinic there. I had already looked into licensing, was getting the process going. And then, you know, life has its own plan.
00;52;39;18 - 00;52;48;28
Emma
And we broke up and I moved home and it was a humbling experience living in my high school bedroom, my twin bed.
00;52;48;28 - 00;52;49;28
Emma
Like, what the.
00;52;49;28 - 00;52;51;25
Emma
Hell this half, 28 years.
00;52;51;25 - 00;52;52;25
Emma
Old.
00;52;52;28 - 00;53;08;10
Emma
Where is my life going? But I there was no other option for me. I was going to open this clinic. That was what I was going to do. Whether it was in Austin or Seattle. I knew that I had been working really hard towards this vision and I was going to make it happen. So while I was going through.
00;53;08;10 - 00;53;14;01
Emma
A breakup and living in the basement in a twin bed and away from my.
00;53;14;01 - 00;53;41;12
Emma
Animals and going through my board exams, I was also getting the pieces together to start looking for a space. And that happened really synchronistic. Like it was just so kismet. There was a posting on a Facebook group in my neighborhood that was in my budget or slightly above what I had budgeted in my business proposal for a one room solo practice.
00;53;41;15 - 00;53;57;24
Emma
And I came by the space and it was earlier than I wanted to sign up for a lease, but it was so perfect. I was like, I can't believe I'm signing a lease for an acupuncture practice before I'm even license. But that really lit a fire on me. Need to make sure that I was going to get it done.
00;53;57;26 - 00;54;19;27
Emma
And I think part of it was just trusting that, you know, it's going to work out and that when you have that energy and you're in flow, it might sound crazy, but I knew it was going to work out. So I got the lease for this place in October. I think I got licensed end of November. I was getting my patient management system set up.
00;54;19;27 - 00;54;30;19
Emma
I was figuring out my LLC taxes like what I had to do for all of that act as insurance. Yeah, it was. It was a whirlwind. I feel like I.
00;54;30;23 - 00;54;34;19
Emma
Blacked out September and you got your on this.
00;54;34;22 - 00;54;38;22
Emma
But it was really fun too. Like when you're in that kind of crunch.
00;54;38;22 - 00;54;39;13
Emma
Period of.
00;54;39;19 - 00;54;41;12
Emma
Creation, you're birthing.
00;54;41;12 - 00;54;41;26
Emma
Something.
00;54;41;26 - 00;54;45;08
Emma
To the world. It sounds so cheesy, but it's true. I mean.
00;54;45;08 - 00;54;45;29
Emma
It's.
00;54;46;01 - 00;54;52;26
Emma
It was magical. And yeah, so I opened in January and here we are.
00;54;52;28 - 00;55;16;05
Stephanie
And what an amazing outlet for when you're going through some difficult stuff with your breakup and studying for the board exams and moving home and still COVID like, I mean, I don't think it's really coincidence that that all happened at the same time and that you ended up in this place. It's like the universal laws of polarity, you know, like you kind of have to break things down to build something up and that's you you built something really amazing.
00;55;16;07 - 00;55;42;05
Emma
It's definitely interesting starting a business. You're really faced with all of your insecurities and. You are kind of forced to work through them and that it's been such an amazing growth period for me, starting this business in so many ways, but also learning about myself and pushing my my comfort boundaries and putting myself out there. It's challenging but really rewarding at the same time.
00;55;42;07 - 00;55;57;07
Stephanie
Yeah, it's never too early to dream and you've obviously been thinking about just ideas of where you want to go with this business and then how do you want to expand yourself into different areas. I'm curious what your vision is for the practice and then for yourself.
00;55;57;10 - 00;56;25;00
Emma
Yeah, for the practice. I really want to hire out within the next year, bring other providers in, whether that's acupuncture or something else. I have always had a dream of having an integrative clinic, so lots of different providers and working for the common goal. I think we'll see how that pans out. Hiring is really terrifying to me. There's just so many steps.
00;56;25;00 - 00;56;48;25
Emma
And do you want to hire 1099 or W2? And how does that work out with taxes? That's a lot to juggle, but you know, one step at a time. And then beyond that, I think something that we've discussed is ideally like my moonshot vision would be having an impact on a more collective level and less like 1 to 1 client relationships at some point.
00;56;48;25 - 00;57;16;11
Emma
I don't know when that will be. And also really involved with these are really cool companies that are coming out that are bringing consumer data direct to consumer. So like health data, that's companies like Aura Ring or Edge companies like Biome, which can give you your biological age from a blood and steel test and then give you targeted supplements to help you for longevity.
00;57;16;14 - 00;57;41;04
Emma
Like there's just so much cool science and so many amazing tools that are coming out. I would love to get involved in in some way, shape or form. I think the first thing to do is showing Griffiths one chapter of this business and then maybe taking an advisory or consulting role in the future, while maybe still having my split and in the client relationship like 1 to 1 treatments as well.
00;57;41;09 - 00;57;42;11
Emma
Yeah.
00;57;42;13 - 00;58;13;18
Stephanie
Well one thing that you said earlier about what success means to you now is having that freedom and flexibility to explore different things that you might be interested in. But I talked to a lot of health related startups and they often have a CMO, like a chief medical officer or something, and whether that's a doctor or some other type of practitioner, it's always useful when they of course have clinical experience, but when they do keep one foot in the door because they keep a pulse on what patients are coming in for, what's working for them, what isn't working for them.
00;58;13;18 - 00;58;23;01
Stephanie
So it's always interesting when they spend a few hours at least in the clinic. It's just so value additive. I think that that's huge.
00;58;23;04 - 00;58;49;20
Emma
I think one other thing that we had talked about to that I think there's a really big opportunity for here in Seattle or the greater Seattle area is some type of social wellness club for young people. There is nothing that exists here like that and I think there's such a need for people, a space for people to come together, to connect for community, but also to optimize their health.
00;58;49;23 - 00;59;01;24
Emma
I see it happening in a lot of other cities and we have the people and the means to do that here is obviously doing something like that in the future because I mean, the leg of the way, if you feel safe.
00;59;01;28 - 00;59;04;08
Stephanie
About that, like nothing gets me more excited than.
00;59;04;10 - 00;59;04;16
Emma
Now.
00;59;04;20 - 00;59;05;24
Emma
I do. I love.
00;59;05;24 - 00;59;10;11
Stephanie
The concept. I'm so desperate for it. Here we have something happening, so.
00;59;10;17 - 00;59;12;24
Emma
Maybe we should partner and create this social.
00;59;12;24 - 00;59;13;20
Emma
Wellness cloud.
00;59;13;20 - 00;59;24;07
Stephanie
2,000%. In the back of my mind, I was like, I've been envisioning this for a long time as as a long term plan. But as we've been talking, I'm like, we just do it.
00;59;24;10 - 00;59;24;20
Emma
I think you.
00;59;24;20 - 00;59;29;01
Emma
Should. Why not? I feel like when you see a poll.
00;59;29;04 - 00;59;31;08
Emma
I don't know if anything I will say I had a.
00;59;31;08 - 00;59;42;11
Emma
Coach tell me once. She said, If you have a dream, the opportunity exists for you out there to accomplish it. And so maybe that's an opportunity.
00;59;42;14 - 00;59;43;06
Stephanie
Like don't play.
00;59;43;06 - 00;59;47;02
Emma
With me because I'm going to cut you off to it as soon as we.
00;59;47;02 - 00;59;48;12
Stephanie
Hang out, press stop recording.
00;59;48;13 - 00;59;55;04
Emma
I'm like, Okay, no, that's one step. One. Oh, thank.
00;59;55;04 - 00;59;59;05
Stephanie
You so, so much for sharing your story. I really appreciate it.
00;59;59;07 - 01;00;07;02
Emma
Thank you for having me on. It was great to.